Naval Gazing Part 3 - a Closer look - Victory at Sea 1:1800 models from Warlord

I think I mentioned how I managed to get a look at the demo set models from Warlord's new "Victory at Sea" set from my local FLGS. They had been assembled in the store but I volunteered to paint them over the lock down. So I've now had a good opportunity to have a look at them, here is an update.

The models are 1:1800 which makes them rather bigger than the usual 1:3000 I'm used to for WW2. This has a couple of interesting points. Firstly, they're bigger  (doh!), which makes them easier to paint. Secondly the level of detail is way higher than you get with Navwar \ Davco, though I can't compare them to GHQ which I've never really seen other than in a breathless nose pressed against the glass sort of way. Main armament turrets and some other details on the cruisers is separate which allows you to pose the turrets or even magnetise them if that is your sort of thing. Having painted a few now I have to say 1:1800 are rapidly gaining my approval.

The models I have finished are a pair of Japanese Mogami Class Heavy Cruisers, and a pair of Fubuki Class Destroyers. The Mogamis are a good example of the way Warlord are presenting these ship classes. The Mogami is (apparently) the 1939 version, however the second model is her sister ship the Kumano in it's 1944 refit with lots more AA, and the model clearly shows the differences.

The USN side consists of a pair of the ubiquitous Fletcher class destroyers and two Northampton class Cruisers, the Northampton and the Chicago - again with different weapon layouts and dates. The bases are marked to that effect.

May need to rethink the deck colour

All the models were speed painted with (mainly) those new fangled Citadel Contrast paints, and touched up with "normal" paint and dry brushing. I think they turned out quite nice and really took no time at all.

The data card in the set is a standard fitting, with notes on the rear showing a number of different refit options. I have mixed feelings about this - the specific naming of ships within a class is quite "kewl" but what happens if I want to do a later refit of a ship that not one of the named selection - do I get a close match and trim the name off?? OK this is very much a First World Problem but it does detract from the "kewl" a bit.

Are the much commented on bases a problem? I'm undecided. They made the models easy to paint, and at least to my eye they don't seem too obtrusive now they are painted. I also think they will help protect the models from handling damage, particularly to paintwork which is the bane of small metal models, so that is good. However I mentioned in the earlier post about the base warping, and in the process of correcting this I snapped one almost in half - clearly misjudged the heat needed to make them flexible. On the other hand repairs were quick and easy as the two halves went together with superglue and the damage on the painted model is (almost) invisible - I'm going to put that down to heavy handedness and unfamiliarity with the resin material used.

I think looking at these now they are painted I am starting to warm to the models and the scale. VAS is not meant to be a game to represent Jutland - like GQ, but what it loses in the grand scale (Grand Fleet scale?) it does seem to make up for with more detail on individual ships both in stats and in the models. Should you rush out and buy fleets in the "new" scale? Well if you already have 1:3000 \ 1:2400 I can see that would be a hard decision and I would probably just wait for the rules to be released and use your existing models. If like me you divested yourself of your WW2 ships some time ago, or have never had any to begin with, then the new models and scale have a lot going for them. 

Once this current social distancing \ lockdown is resolved I will hopefully get some games played and a better assessment of the game as a whole. Til then, stay safe.

Naval Gazing Part 2 - the rules - first impressions

OK so I mentioned seeing the VAS (Victory at Sea) demo set at our FLGS. Sadly I didn't have a chance to read through the rules at the time, but since then I seem to have quite a bit of time on my hands.......

Sadly what I don't have at the moment is ships, or an opponent, so this is going to be a bit "blue sky". or possibly "blue sea". I also have to say I have not played any WW2 naval other than Coastal Forces for quite a while and am quite set in my ways - "if GQ2 was good enough in 1980, it is good enough now" sort of thing. I didn't play the original Victory at Sea either, so bear that in mind.

However I do now have a copy of the starter rules and here are my initial thoughts.

Firstly these are the starter rules, not the full thing. They don't contain any stats for ships other than a couple of battleships. The stats are usually on the data cards provided with the models, however I understand there is a compendium of ships to follow which includes all the stats you will need. I appreciate this will be seen as an attempt to tie players in to Warlord models, which to some extent I think it is, however that's just modern gaming and will take about a minute to resolve if you want to use third party models or a different scale. They're also NOT a straight  lift from the previously published VAS v1 from Mongoose - there is clearly quite a bit of development and polish applied.

On scale, all measurement is from (and I assume to) the ship's bridge, which seems eminently sensible, so there is nothing in the rules that prevents you from using other scales if you already have them.

The actual layout is very good - which we have come to expect from recent Warlord releases. What did strike me immediately is that these rules are not full of Osprey plates, instead they are illustrated with some very nice photo-shopped images of the actual models, plus some artwork that I suspect has been commissioned for the job. There is one glaring and frankly unforgivable picture on page 4 which is in a very different style and appears to show HMS Warspite firing her "A" turret to starboard and simultaneously firing "B" turret to port. I have no words. This is so out of character to the rest of the illustrations I suspect it is a carry over from an earlier Mongoose version - but I digress.

The rules seem simple and straightforward. Initiative followed by alternative movement with the loser going first (not very realistic but a common game mechanic, which means no manoeuvring by squadron) with the shooting phase following the same alternating ship by ship but with the winner shooting first. As damage is applied immediately this could make for some interesting and tense decisions - always a good thing. Gunnery is a "bucket of dice" system which looks perfectly serviceable - normal range being out to 30" - if you want to shoot further you need some spotter aircraft or similar and can only hit stationary targets. Torpedo are just treated as another weapon system, usually one shot but devastating (I suspect a carry over from the sci fi roots of VAS but not unreasonable). Damage is assessed as cumulative damage points lost with a "Crippled" threshold, plus a critical hit system, again nothing new but nothing to suggest any problems. There's is a simple but easy to use damage control system for tracking the ongoing effects of fires and floods with the chance of fixing or the situation worsening, which I liked.  All the rules are clear and well explained and have illustrations to help - at least I found them clear (!)

There is an interesting crew order system to allow you to get your ship to do interesting stuff , some of which are automatic, some are based on a crew quality check which is usually 50/50.

Aircraft are covered in depth, but the stats in the starter set are very restricted - only one type per nation except the Germans who for some reason get the carrier borne versions of the Bf109 and Ju87. It seems strange to include these in the game at all given the number of German aircraft carriers operating in WW2, which was none, to several decimal places.

The second half of the rules covers scenarios, and these are interesting. It's clear that Warlord are aiming for casual "points" based games rather than re-fighting North Cape, but the scenarios provided do look well thought out and will generate interesting games. Having said that these are not totally disconnected from historical reality - you don't need to put your carriers on table for instance, which was refreshing.

Lastly there is the inevitable National fleet sections with special rules for each nation in the initial release, plus some passing mention of French and Italians. These are going to cause some comments, particularly from the historical naval players out there, but I think they do add flavour.

So I can't in all honesty say much about the rules til I play them properly a few times. That being said, my first impressions are broadly positive. I think these rules will give a fast and fun WW2 naval game. I'm 100% certain these will not appeal to everyone, particularly the "Old Salt" naval gamer, but for the casual gamer I think these are going to be worth a look.

Cheers

Naval Gazing - First look at Warlord's new Victory at Sea

I was hanging around our FLGS mulling over what I would need in the way of supplies for the coming "Isolation", when a parcel was delivered from Warlord Games. It was the demo set of the new(to Warlord - more later) Victory at Sea WW2 naval game, due for release in April.

I'm interested in "this sort of thing" so decided to hang around and take a look. The demo set was not the full starter set - more on that later, but it is enough to show the basic mechanics. It contains 2 Cruisers and 2 Destroyers for both sides, Japanese getting Mogami's and Fubuki Class, US Northampton and Fletcher.

So first the models. These have come in for a lot of initial flak due to the very pronounced oval bases when seen in Warlord's promo pics. I'll come back to the bases in a bit, but the actual models look rather good. They're in the new "Warlord resin" and the castings I saw were crisp and clean, and looked very accurate. The scale s 1:1800 which is NOT a proprietary scale, despite what a lot of people think, and actually I think in this case it is a good choice - small enough to get some impression of ranges, but big enough to gave plenty of detail. The models came as a hull fixed to the base, which has some nice wave details, and a small sprue of detailing parts - turrets,  catapults etc. There was some warping but I expect that should be an easy fix with a quick hot water bath.

Now on to the "hovercraft" effect of the bases  In real life I don't think it is that bad. A quick read of the rules - which I assume are a cut down version, shows no need for the bases as part of the rules mechanics. My assumption is that they needed to base depth to make the casting easier and to allow them to have the names on the bases (which they do - individual ships on the Cruisers and classes on the DDs). Only Warlord know. I think they have made the issue worse in their photos by drybrushing the waves on their model bases, which creates an optical effect of emphasising the darker sides of the base - I suspect painting the sides of the bases a lighter shade would be a good idea.

I didn't get a chance to look at the rules themselves, but the accompanying punch board with tokens and turning angle thing etc was good quality and should last - not so sure about the paper sea mats which will I guess be the first thing to be replaced, but it makes sense to include them. The data cards seemed quite detailed - no idea of how accurate they are as I never got to look at them for any length of time. The damage track "clips" beloved of Warlord make a reappearance but these look to have been redesigned a bit and hopefully will work better than those in Cruel Seas. 

So - lastly a bit of history of Victory at Seas. Not something I have played, being a Dyed in the Wool General Quarters player. This game started out as a Sci Fi set of rules for Babylon 5 iirc, by Mongoose Publishing and it was modified by some enterprising folk to cover real WW 1 & 2 era games - not sure what that says about the rules but the general consensus was that the V1 set worked and gave a reasonably fun game, if not too accurate. V2 was scheduled but never completed, along with some detailed 3d mastered ships - about 50 so I am told. Warlord have done a deal with Mongoose and released this version along with the models. Not sure if this is indeed V1, V2 or somewhere in between. The starter fleets will be available through retail but the suggestion is the follow on models may only be direct sales.

First thoughts are this could be a winner - I know I said that about SPQR and that turned into a disaster to play in record time. In this case I think we are on firmer ground as there is a decade of testing the VAS system in it's various forms so it should have had most of the kinks ironed out.

The starter set is a USN\ v IJN affair and contains 3 US Cruisers and 6 Destroyers  vs 3 IJN Cruisers and 3 Destroyers. There are also Fleet Boxes that add battleships and Carriers and also some Battleships available as single packs.

One to watch

ps I think the ships would make excellent target markers for Blood Red Skies.

Thanks to Ste at Asgard Wargames for the pics - Cheers M8 - and if you're interested in VAS Asgard will have them on pre order now https://asgardwargames.co.uk/product-category/victory-at-sea